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CoVid - 19 (17/03/20 02:00:17) Reply
    Maybe my hope to find a place where I could try to discuss the facts of and measures against this pandemic was false.

    Anyway. I'll try again.


    What do you guys think about the spreading of the virus?
    How far has it gone? How reliable are our sources?

    Could we please keep to strictly scientific sources/numbers here?
gs
Re: CoVid - 19 (17/03/20 04:00:25) Reply
    Hail

    I came back to this site after 12 years, to look for some 'truth' back in January with disbelief with what I was seeing/being told was happening in china and what everyone else was doing. (nothing) (Canada, US)

    Like to discuss... it seems information is staggered (4-6 weeks) to reduce panic, and then as the cases grow and people became acclimated the information is msm

    Will get links but, I believe the gist is transmission (without symptoms) up to 28 days.
    I know that the case in Vancouver which caused the MSM reported first-second and third death was spread (possibly) by a worker who I believe was suspected case, and put into quarantine for 14 days then released to work there.
elsalvo
Re: Re: CoVid - 19 (17/03/20 06:05:05) Reply
    It was the up to 25+ day asymptomatic spreading elsalvo mentions that made me button down as soon as I did, realizing as I did in in mid january that as corona-chan started in wuhan on or around december 1, by january 20 it could have spread to the usa ( as it had ) undetected ( which it did ) by early january. now that the stores are empty and enforced self-isolation is taking place piecemeal nationwide I'm ok with starting 7 weeks early. Let us know when they extend the quarantine to 21 days, a week or more short of surety. I'll let them young-uns wrastle up that there herd-immunity and I'll buy it on amazon later, tyvm. I hear it's like that ebola herd-immunity I heard tell of so often.


    https://capitalisteric.wordpress.com/2020/03/08/coronavirus-blunt-truth/

    https://capitalisteric.wordpress.com/2020/03/10/coronavirus-blunt-truth-part-2-hitting-the-wall/

    It's just a flu, bros - from bat & snake soup

    https://www.muggsmugs.com/uploads/1/2/4/3/124351356/s170241733445503120_p26_i1_w1000.jpeg
forseti
Spreading (17/03/20 07:07:15) Reply
    I think we see a difficult mix of splendid basic scientific facts from Chinese sources and a good deal of unverifiable and disturbing anecdotes that need to be taken into account if there is hope of making a sustainable policy.
    I think there will be a lot to learn from the different national policies, specially with regard to schools being open (UK, Sweden) or closed (Germany, Norway). Open schools will accelerate spread among the youngest part of the population, but may cause a very high peak prevalence of infection.

    Examples have shown that it is possible to trace routes of infection in almost real time by picking up active cases. The means are not OK - they have serious potential for abuse.

    But I believe there are examples that there are dormant reservoirs of virus - on surfaces, frozen foods or fabrics. If so, it will be impossible to eradicate it, no matter how strict measures are taken in society.

    In the struggle against COVID-19 there are millions of unseen sufferers and unsung heroes. I hope this will have a political impact reversing some of the disgusting developments of the last decade or four.

    But it isn't science.
e
Clearance? (17/03/20 07:48:56) Reply
    Another AFAIK unanswered question is: How many of those who have recovered from the acute infection are still carriers of the virus and will reactivate it when they are subject to some external stress? I have a hunch that this is what we see with the common cold: The defenses fall down after a cold stress, and the infection returns.

    I think this should be one of the scenarios to be used for future planning - together with the more optimistic ones presupposing eradication. If the common cold model is really the case, then the present-day draconic measures do not seem sustainable at all. Then it will be a question of deliberately and visibly balancing the saving of life against economics. I think this will force an honest debate and weaken the political power of the hypocrites.
e
immunity (17/03/20 17:42:11) Reply
    Another question, that has not been sufficiently answered, is:
    Do human beings get immune after they were sick - and if so, for how long?

    I read they found that monkeys aquired immunity, but they can't tell yet for how long it will last.
gs
Re: immunity (17/03/20 18:21:22) Reply
    And bats seem to be a natural reservoir. So there cannot be immunity strong enough to eradicate the virus in bats.
e
Re: Re: immunity (21/03/20 03:45:58) Reply
    There's been a pretty long thread on twitter about this topic.


    https://twitter.com/NAChristakis/status/1240689935557865472
gs
just like every flu season (17/03/20 23:04:57) Reply
    https://twitter.com/coronadiarys/status/1238829465729368065

    like every year I remember, nothing different.

    keep waiting for scientific proof.
forseti
Re: just like every flu season (21/03/20 03:56:43) Reply
    It's got nothing to do wit the #coronavirus. It's just the regular shift of the Belgian an Dutch military that happens every month or so.

    Must have to do with the moon, I guess.


    -----------------------


    Hey, c'mon! I don't have any clue when that video is from (or where).
    But I can assure you, there's no military deployment in Western Europe.

    We would have heard. We would have noticed. Military deployments don't go unnoticed, neither in Germany nor in The Netherlands, Belgium or Denmark.
    Especially not in times as now. Have you seen any reports about what European borders look like nowadays? They are closed. And they are packed with 50-miles-long traffic jams of trucks (Germany to Poland, for instance). Which is a shame! (But that's a different topic)


    There's been no suspicious planes spraying stuff, either.
    So...
gs
Ein Nichtsburger, ja Bruder (22/03/20 23:46:10) Reply
    https://twitter.com/deutsch365/status/1241822001444073477

    ebenfalls Merkel muss weg... zur Isolation mit Harvey Weinstein, wohlmöglich?

    Bitte haben Sie eine köstliche Sowjetwelle: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBmKLYoggkA Ich fange wirklich an, diesen Stil zu mögen.

    Liebe
forseti
Re: CoVid - 19 (17/03/20 08:52:40) Reply
    I think we see some small signs that people really in the know now slowly are gaining power. For years we have had to witness, powerless, non-brilliant people snake oiling themselves into positions or leadership, where their actions and strategies have been power for the sake of power, and money for themselves.
e
Exposing fake meritocracies (17/03/20 10:48:42) Reply
    Our national institute of health, our directorate of health, our ministry of health have - together - been a cesspool of indecision, vague advice and reluctance against taking responsibility. At the face of it this would be surprising, looking at academic merit and academic titles of those people, and their placement in the hierarchy. One would think that the positions at this level would be merit based. And they are. All the right boxes have been ticked. But the reality? hey have been doing the profitable work. The low-hanging fruit, doing the things that just work. In my opinion we would need stronger influence from the people who have made the system just work. Giving orders and taking the praise isn't real merit when real work and real thinking needs to be done.

    In Norway nothing really happened until the head of Bergen municipality closed institutions on his home turf, quoting his own experts at his province university. Only then the capital followed up, and only then the government found it safe to act. And even then they did not follow their own rules, so quite a few of them are now in quarantaine. Deeply embarrassing, I'd say, but probably not embarrassing enough.
e
What would a designer genocidal virus be like? (17/03/20 18:20:11) Reply
    COVID-19 seems to carry too low lethality to be one. A deliberately constructed killer virus giving poor immunity in the survivors seems like a poorly thought-out crime compared to the resources - physical and mental - needed to build the virus.

    According to Wikipedia the corona viruses are among the more complex viruses. It might be easier to build something simpler. Making a virus that is being destroyed by detergent might be silly or shrewd - maybe both - because it is easier to get rid of by simple cleaning.
e
Re: What would a designer genocidal virus be like? (18/03/20 18:33:51) Reply
    so a virus that does not kill too quickly or too many, has silent spreading for a month, which hospitalizes 20% of inflicted, leaves survivors with permanently reduced lung function, prone to re-infection and sudden death from heart failure, respiratory failure from brainstem rot, and possible male sterility from ace2 binding in testes and may require life-long treatment from antiviral drugs to prevent re-infection ( you could look all those up ) and it sounds like covid-19 couldn't be a weapon?

    And because you can't imagine how or why someone else might make it, it cannot exist?

    "a poorly thought-out crime" from the inheritors of Mao or Dulles bros or...?

    Who could imagine? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svdrAHn_LGo "It's a real scene man."

    https://images3.memedroid.com/images/UPLOADED122/5e63df371a21b.jpeg

    love
forseti
Re: ( you could look all those up ) (18/03/20 23:19:34) Reply
    Infection might cause male infertility
    https://archive.is/NLz11

    Virus infects bacteria, lives in guts indefinitely
    https://archive.is/CI9sO

    Asymptomatic concentrate virions at nose, more infectious
    https://archive.is/RypEi

    Virus spreads through pipes
    https://archive.is/dTtfj

    Survivors will be immunocompromised
    https://archive.is/2EQ6x

    >REMINDER
    US prepares for 4.8 million hospitalizations
    https://archive.is/7BkR0

    210 dead in Iran, regime covers it up
    https://archive.is/D7YcK

    CDC declares outbreak endemic, says tests too risky
    https://archive.is/Em4Pj

    China biowarfare program might have gone wrong
    https://archive.is/z1nbD

    China province outbreak 52 times worse than admitted
    https://archive.is/N3xns

    >MORE
    https://pastebin.com/raw/qy5RFpVX
forseti
Re: Exposing fake meritocracies (19/03/20 03:47:42) Reply
    even Karl is not buying the dipshits

    https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=238518

    also in terms of exposing the absolute horror of the american medical system and it's racketeering anti-competitive confidence game that site is a goldmine:

    https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=163849

    https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=163733

    https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231949

    nota bene: strong language, facts - dear reader may want to have a fainting couch and smelling salts nearby

    He is a one of few lamenting the horrible mercantile interference with healing and wellness, taken from a calling and corrupted into to a "profession" four or more generations ago. The damage is incalculable.


    love
forseti
Re: CoVid - 19 (17/03/20 18:43:05) Reply
    https://i.imgur.com/J8R2cHV.jpg
january 31 2020
Well (17/03/20 19:59:16) Reply
    If they sweepingly say "vain" (Italy) attempt instead of showing figures or discussing facts and mechanisms, it looks like non-factual scaremongering. And the sources? Hearsay from a non-identified source at WHO, plus people in finance.

    Ah, the people I would trust without any questions or any doubt.
e
Re: wishingWell (17/03/20 21:12:27) Reply
    nitpicking some minor discrepancies from an off the cuff warning to a mongolian basket weaving forum from 56 days ago, that correctly predicted: italy infection, official channels silent and then downplaying for months until it becomes too obvious to keep lying, the brazil infection, ( just stating to reveal now ) airline and hotel stocks crashing, china falsely claiming all is well now, ( when cities are going back to lockdown now ) the usa west coast homeless infection, ( just starting to reveal now ) and the date of the market crash, not february but march.

    But sure, throw it all out because an anonymous person on an anime imageboard who was only trying to warn people didn't get into exactingly correct detail about the italian response 2 whole months before now. Nevermind, that the italians themselves had no fucking idea about the shit italian response until 2 weeks ago, and they are still reeling and trying to warn the rest of the world to not make their mistakes. But yeah judge a book by it's cover and discard correct predictions because you don't approve of their career choice. Yeah that's logical.

    I'm saddened at lack of reciprocal concern and expression of friendship here among friends.

    wishing you all well

    love
forseti
oops 46 days (17/03/20 21:24:08) Reply
    must mean it's all wrong, right, cuz I made a math mistake thinking the post was from 21 jan, Right?

    It's an empty bun

    a nothingburger
forset
Re: oops 46 days (17/03/20 23:06:43) Reply
    In this sea of conflicting information there it will be impossible to know the whole truth even afterwards.

    People of poor health will be more susceptible. Smokers will be more susceptible. Old people will be more susceptible. People living under poor sanitary conditions with poor nutrition and poor hygiene will be more susceptible.

    OK - let's distrust Chinese statistics. Let's distrust the Italian age distribution data. And above all: Let's distrust well-established liars - no names mentioned.

    In the end there will be whistleblowers providing trustable statistics if official statistics are fake. We will have to wait.
e
still too conservative (18/03/20 00:13:07) Reply
    A warm welcome please, for the "Institute for Disease and Emergency Analytics Imperial college London" conspiracy theorist tinfoil hat Club!

    https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imperial-college/medicine/sph/ide/gida-fellowships/Imperial-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf


    Still underestimating asymptomatic spreading, incubation period, and viral load shedding and reinfection post "cured." but heading in the right direction. Expect another update & revision to "oh shit it's worse" in 5-10 days.
forseti
Re: CoVid - 19 (18/03/20 17:49:50) Reply
    more tinfoil-hattery from those loons at "sciencemag" whoever that is,I mean really, who reads this stuff? - a vast bat-wing conspiracy!!!

    https://science.sciencemag.org/content/sci/early/2020/03/13/science.abb3221.full.pdf

    "We estimate 86% of all infections were undocumented (95% CI: [82%–90%]) prior to 23 January 2020 travel restrictions."

    It's almost like the virus has an indeterminately long asymptomatic spreading period which should be estimated to be 150% of the longest known number of days ( around 31 days ) to be safe in quarantine situations.
forseti
Geert smelt sneeuwvlok? (18/03/20 19:06:31) Reply
    https://twitter.com/Jan_mers/status/1240343340467531777

    het is gewoon een griep, bru
forseti
waking up to a new reality (19/03/20 01:45:39) Reply
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRR2ot8CuM4

    affluent boomers share a wtf moment.

    He's had a very decent series tracking the epidemic for months

    playlist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRR2ot8CuM4&list=PLRgTUN1zz_oeQpnJxpeaEkFimDeepqyWf


    skrimps has been tracking for months too, many videos deleted

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwL5FzainYw4c6hStu-DibA/videos

    there were others, mostly documenting the chinese outbreak from inside china, they are mostly deleted now.

    merkel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5yAHW44BSA

    Pommes Dauphine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHi75sMAPL8

    end on a happy note, oui?

    love
forseti
Biased reporting (20/03/20 06:13:19) Reply
    Every fresh-from-university physician has a shock experience after the first days and nights in the frontline of a hospital: Writing death certificates on patients arriving dead or dying in the emergency room. Writing heart failure is explicitly forbidden: this is regarded as a mode of dying, not the cause of dying. So - coronary heart disease through myocardial infaction throug post-infarction myocardial failure - then death.

    With 99 percent of those dying related to the COVID-19, the virus pneumonia was the final event - true enough - but the underlying weakness of the body was severe, so the capacity to tolerate the extra stress on the system was not there.
    And then there is the bias caused by too limited testing. The severe cases will be easy to find and count. The infected with low-grade clinical manifestations may be impossible to detect or count reliably. So the denominator becomes too small, and the percentages too high.
e
naturally occurring bat soup not aging too well (23/05/20 11:02:40) Reply
    https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/may/21/australian-researchers-see-virus-design-manipulati/

    no endemic pool in nature - oops not from bat soup or pangolins

    angiotensin-converting enzyme 2 - line the inside of the eyelids among other places - a mask alone won't do, one will need an fm53 or equiv.

    conspiracy theory peer review - Aussie researchers better hurryap ay? before they get invaded.
forseti
Re: naturally occurring bat soup not aging too well (23/05/20 13:59:04) Reply
    Does anyone here have some biology/chemistry/nutritional knowledge, this guy seemed to be a head of the curve months before MSM:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnOyFhEg4Ac

    He talks about the HCQ controversy, or the fact that MSM seems to be avoiding researching HCQ and ZINC as a cheap preventative for the virus replication. But emphasizing the danger of HCQ by itself.
    Maybe zinc and quertin(sp) - over the counter nutrient, allows zinc to enter our cells better as what the HCQ does.

    In earlier videos...

    He also talks about 'cleaves' and stuff the gist being that its highly improbable a natural thing, as well as gain of function research by stakeholders in US such as DR.F.
elsalvo
Re: Re: naturally occurring bat soup not aging too well (08/08/20 22:19:30) Reply
    Quercetin
    https://www.webmd.com/vitamins/ai/ingredientmono-294/quercetin

    is in the antioxidant culture palette. Nobody has convinced me that antioxidants is a valuable therapeutic principle. We have one important endogenous antioxidant - the glutathione system.
    If quercetin is active in cell culture, that fact is not proof that it will work in a living human.

    Zinc? We all have zinc. Is there evidence that a zinc overdose will help, or that zinc deficiency is promoting the SARS-2 infection? I cannot see a mechanism.

    A vaccine? It must give a long-lasting effective immune response. I would prefer a vaccine giving a strong and long-lasting IgA response, protecting mucous membranes in the airways.
e
Re: Re: Re: naturally occurring bat soup not aging too well (10/08/20 17:03:46) Reply
    Half-life for immunoglubulins is short, so a vaccine working via immunoglobulins will need to start a sustained synthesis to make up for continuous breakdown, or there must be some memory system available to keep a low-grade protection of sorts that is kept up for years and hopefully can be scaled up at need.

    A SARS-2 vaccine may need more than one component to give sufficient coverage. If so, we will need to wait for years for the definite vaccine.
e
Re: Re: Re: naturally occurring bat soup not aging too well (31/08/20 03:34:18) Reply
    Thanks e for your take on it... I guess thats the key to determine if there is such evidence to suggest that these components work inside a human body. I guess the research and the money to fund isn't as readily available compared to the sexy patent-able drugs and vaccines.
elsalvo
Re: CoVid - 19 - Am I missing something here about vaccines? (20/07/20 22:25:01) Reply
    Writing from UK, early on I was amazed with the faith in potential vaccines. Don't vaccines depend on the development of antibodies && isn't it a Coronavirus like the common cold for which there is no or negligible antivirus protection?

    I'm finding it absurd that governments are apparently spending millions or billions on vaccines that are obviously not feasible. Is it only that they are being seen to do something? Corruption?
peed cat
Re: Re: CoVid - 19 - Am I missing something here about vaccines? (26/07/20 00:35:46) Reply
    Having researched a little further, it may be possible to increase the antibody response by e.g. applying the vaccination as a series. I would suggest that a Covid-19 vaccine remains questionable.
peed cat
Re: Re: Re: CoVid - 19 - Am I missing something here about vaccines? (26/07/20 18:21:37) Reply
    Mandatory mask training at this stage of the game, to accept wearing a mask with minimal or no benefit, like these rushed coronavirus vaccines. Gauge public response? With some variants with modification of DNA? Use your imagination, lots of nightmare fuel.
elsalvo
Re: Re: CoVid - 19 - Am I missing something here about vaccines? (08/08/20 22:02:56) Reply
    Some sources suggest - with minimal backing evidence - that there could be cross-immunity between common-cold coronavirus and the SARS-2 virus. If so, that might explain some of the variable susceptibility.
e
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